national id cards...

[Metgod]

National ID Legislation Passes

Tuesday May 10th 2005 is the day that future historians will note as The Day America Changed.  On this date, the Senate of the United States of America passed legislation that will bring about a national ID card.  President G. W. Bush is expected to sign the bill on May 12th 2005.  The national ID card scheme will take three years to implement.

http://www.unrealid.com

What does everyone think ? Fucking scary.. less and less of a democracy, more and more like dictatorship... among other things it resembles in history.

[Tazinator]

Not sure what to say on it honestly. Lots of countries have something similar in place. I believe Canada has something similar, Germany, and some others. I dont see it nessisarily as a completely bad idea.

It will certainly make it so things are a bit harder to fake at airports and such so maybe we wont need to get the TSA people giving us the rubber glove treatment as much once its implimented since they will be a bit harder to fake then a Drivers Liscense.

Yes I agree that identity theft will probably become easier since they will be readable by a slew of devices, but I dont think it will make it all that much easier then ID theft is now a days. Its still incredibly easy to swipe an ID from someone and open a bank account and even get a Drivers Liscense in that name in some states using a PO Box for an addy. Just means people need to learn to be a bit more cautious about where they swipe their ID or who they let handle it is all.

I think theres a bit of over-reaction to this by some liberal extremeists. Its not as bad as some are saying, if it were there would be more resistance to it and it probably wouldnt have passed in the senate with such a high popularity (I think it was almost unanimous) because even the Patriot Act (which I personally hate for many many reasons) had strong opposition and still does.

Some of the positives to this is possibly the lack of a need for a passport if you have this card. Maybe they will link it to your Credit Cards somehow down the road making credit card fraud harder to pull off. Theres lots of positives that can come about if this is done right. Thats the key phrase there "if its done right".

[Cobra]

France have something similar in place aswell. The EU (European Union, you know... the place that is bigger than the US) are suppose to be putting something like this in place aswell. But it will hold blood type and other medical information aswell...


Baaaaaaaad idea!

[Metgod]

Yeah...

This will have blood type too from the pictures I've seen.

I have mixed feelings here. What I don't understand is how religion is relevant. I hate religion (though I have religious friends that are quite close to me) but even if I didn't, who the hell is the state to keep track of that on a card for everyone ?

It's totally irrelevant and to keep track of it.

The blood type could be useful for some people (like if you're in an accident and they need to do a quick transfusion but I still don't like the idea of all this on a card). Besides, that's what medical necklaces/bracelets are for..

Yes we will have to be more careful but that's not what bugs me... what bugs me is keeping track of irrelevant information. Next thing you'll know they'll keep track of mental health, and other illnessses... it may not happen, but the fact that this can happen shows that the next thing _could_ happen and it opens up more leeway for it.

My first reaction was to think of the SS. I realize it won't be that bad, but it was my initial thinking (esp. since I've seen other similar things in this country -- probably others too -- that remind me of that).

On the other hand, Australia has something similar, and it's not nearly as bad as it might seem. So I don't know...

Either way, I think it's very wrong to force this upon people -- ethically -- but it happens I guess. I just don't see how this will help. I don't think getting less  privacy is the way to get more security. Jefferson definitely agreed there.

As for the vote.. it's probably because the idiot who came up with it was allowed to put it on another bill that 'needed' to be passed.

I think it's a bad idea.. if it makes you more comfortable, then I think you have serious other issues (and too much fear on your mind). I think that's another thing:

It tells the terrorists that... they won. That they've put fear into the country. I look at it from the psychological perspection, and in all honesty, this WILL give them the feeling that they're in control. And that's pretty mild compared to what some people on the site I linked to have said... so I'm definitely not the only one who is against it.

But not much I can do... so I guess I have to get over it (and really I am more or less... but still annoying when I think about it).

*shrug*

[Metgod]

Well my medical record wouldn't fit on a million cards but that's another story

Of course you're right about there is good and bad to everything. I don't mean that it'll be exactly like the SS, but I think it's similar in nature as far as keeping track of religion, etc.

It's totally irrelevant... I mean unless they're going to restrict things or cause problems for certain religions, why bother ? We know they can't restrict things like that (yet ), so I just don't see the point. Admittedly I am very against religion (though close friends are religious and so is some of my family) so it'll harm me least to have 'NA' or something.

I think for me it's the principle of the matter. There is no need for it. I will say I agree to one thing though: they should have done something years back rather than pissing around and waiting for it to happen. They should know better with all the gov't systems being broken in to (and other things too). But sadly they just wait around.

So the thing that bugs me overall is there are better ways to do it and they should have done those things a long time ago.

Give a little and take a little I guess... I can't be satisifed with everything they do but other things I am (like restricting smoking in public buildings in California is a big thing for me -- saves me from a hospital visit everytime I walk in a building).

As for your last paragraph.. we can only hope that's the case.

As for my comment about SS... there are a lot of things that resemble that regime (not the SS itself but that era). And I don't like that. I have plenty examples, but like you implied (Or I think you did), it's a matter of how you view it and what really happens is the most important thing.

I guess a big concern of mine is that by doing this card deal, it only opens another way for the gov't to do more (and it only shows 'them' they 'won').

But we have 3 years and then we'll see how it is. Only time can tell.

[DXT]

that will suck if they do start to use this it just show how much the world is becomeing like 1984

[wilnix]

Soon enough, you'll be scanning your hand instead of showing ID. The difference will be that ALL vital information will be there: name, ssn, bd, medical records, financial info, you name it....

1984 is just the beginning...


Wilnix

[Darksat]

These guys are a lot more subtle than 1984s Big Brother.

[Ramesses]

Back in 2006 when the US started using RFID in passports, there were concerns of sniffing.  To combat this, the new passports have covers with a woven Faraday cage built into them.  The passports also require a PIN on the reader side to read that particular chip.  This means there is a PIN inside the passport where the passport has to be opened, turned to that page, and PIN entered into the reader in order to access the data on that RFID chip.  These are passive RFID in the national ID which means it can only be read from a relatively short distance.  There are some alarmists out there that say the government will be able to track you using satellites.  This is impossible as the resonant signal returned by these passive chips will not extend that far.  The only way to track a particular passive RFID is by tagging it and linking it to a GPS unit such as when inventory is loaded onto a truck for shipment.  Of course, the government could always make this happen automatically with mass transit but the constitution still will not allow this invasion of privacy in personal vehicles (however, the whole hidden black box argument comes to mind here).  Anyone else have more thought on this now that more info is coming out?